meppi64

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,479
What do you guys know about the Pokemon Mini? I just did a little write up of its pinball game on my twitter.



Is there any way to play Shin Megami Tensei Pinball: Judgement? It was released for mobile in Japan-only around 2005. It's a Kaze game (Super Pinball, Necronomicon, Last Gladiators, Power Rangers Zeo Pinball, etc).

I think it may be lost forever.

latest

latest

latest

It's been a really long time since I played that Pokémon Mini pinball game.
It's actually the only game I have for the Pokémon Mini system.
Don't really remember anything about it so it didn't leave much of an impression on me. Probably way too simplistic and I just went back to the GBC game, I guess.
I don't know where the system itself is and I should buy some batteries if I find it to check it out once more...

Heard something about preservation of old Japanese mobile games a couple of weeks ago. I think it must have been on a podcast.
Not sure if that's actually a thing or if the person was talking about how it should be a thing since so many games are otherwise just gone forever. :-/


Oh and I really need a little help here.
I'm 15 minutes or so into watching Special When Lit documentary on pinball machines from 2009.
This just came up:

aN6DeSx.jpg


And I had another flashback moment.
The side art with the blue and purple behind him with the hand holding a trident, what game is that from?
We had that one as well at one time in the bar where I grew up. One of the few things I seem to remember vividly is the side art to the games we had there, but not the table names or anything else, till I hear the sounds and see how the ball actually travels on the tables.
Just random visual and audio cues here or there....

Also the one person from the pinball museum in France just mentioned how you couldn't find any tables anywhere anymore. Named a couple of countries and then came to Belgium. Said you couldn't find anything anymore and how it used to be a pinball paradise.
Might explain a bit why even in my neck of the woods I got to play tables that had such an incredible low run and that people seem to talk about having never come across in real life on the shows...
 

meppi64

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,479
I just learned that SMT Pinball was actually Kaze's last game...



That game is literally called Trident and it was made by Stern Electronics (the old company) in 1979

6270310241_ced4649594.jpg
Oh man! Thank you so much once again!

That one brings back so many memories. That one probably stayed in the cafe for quite a while. Those two spinners as well a the three lights on the right one are burned into my memory. As well as the right drain with the opportunity to save your ball.
I wonder how many days of playtime I must have had on this one.
I must have been 3 or 4 at the time, yet it's one of the only things I remember so clearly!
The other one is playing the Space Invaders cabinet with the cellophane overlay on the screen and Asteroids as well. :)
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Oh man! Thank you so much once again!

That one brings back so many memories. That one probably stayed in the cafe for quite a while. Those two spinners as well a the three lights on the right one are burned into my memory. As well as the right drain with the opportunity to save your ball.
I wonder how many days of playtime I must have had on this one.
I must have been 3 or 4 at the time, yet it's one of the only things I remember so clearly!
The other one is playing the Space Invaders cabinet with the cellophane overlay on the screen and Asteroids as well. :)

Happy to assist!
 

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
Let's talk on how Nintendo Switch's current firmare only auto updates the 12 most recent played games. So for the rest of games not appearing in the main menu, you need to manually check if there are new updates.

And how since December, I'm every day looking for new updates for 'Stern Pinball Arcade' to see if they implement a TATE portable mode similar to 'Pinball FX3'.

And how every single day, I manually check if there is some new update for 'Pinball FX 3' increasing the FPS to 60 in portable mode, with no luck.

At least, you can play 'Pinball FX3' in TATE mode by connecting the game to a monitor. But I really need to have my pinball fix on the go.

On a non surrealistic note not related on how doomed I have been with pinball games in these last two months... what an amazing discovery this Shin Megami Tensei pinball game!
 

meppi64

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,479
It's somewhat similar on PS4. Not sure how many games it keeps track of, but it stops updating games you haven't played in a while.
No idea for Xbox though.
 
OP
OP
Shaneus

Shaneus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,927
And how since December, I'm every day looking for new updates for 'Stern Pinball Arcade' to see if they implement a TATE portable mode similar to 'Pinball FX3'.
Ah man, get used to promised, yet still missing updates from Farsight on TPA and Stern Pinball Arcade. They're the fucking worst.
 

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
Ah man, get used to promised, yet still missing updates from Farsight on TPA and Stern Pinball Arcade. They're the fucking worst.

The most ironical thing is that indeed, they put an update with TATE mode. But it was broken and it doesn't work. So they didn't test the patch :)
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Shaneus

Shaneus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,927
The most ironical thing is that indeed, they put an update with TATE mode. But it was broken and it doesn't work. So they don't tested the patch :)
They never do. They released several updates to Ghostbusters on iOS TPA, but only fixed the issue with not being able to select skill shots at the start (how can you not see that's an issue when you first release the table?!?). Completely missing the fact that the mode arrows weren't lighting AT ALL. SMFH.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Let's talk on how Nintendo Switch's current firmare only auto updates the 12 most recent played games. So for the rest of games not appearing in the main menu, you need to manually check if there are new updates.

And how since December, I'm every day looking for new updates for 'Stern Pinball Arcade' to see if they implement a TATE portable mode similar to 'Pinball FX3'.

And how every single day, I manually check if there is some new update for 'Pinball FX 3' increasing the FPS to 60 in portable mode, with no luck.

At least, you can play 'Pinball FX3' in TATE mode by connecting the game to a monitor. But I really need to have my pinball fix on the go.

On a non surrealistic note not related on how doomed I have been with pinball games in these last two months... what an amazing discovery this Shin Megami Tensei pinball game!

Oh yes, Farsight is the worst. But they literally are the only developer making digital conversions of real pinball tables (outside of Zaccaria which is only Zaccaria table, finished and on a fraction of the platforms). So if you enjoy pinball and want to play these games it's TPA/SPA or the community-supported Visual Pinball. The latter is only an option on PC and it can be just as iffy and three times the hassle.

As for amazing pinball discoveries, I have another for you that just recently became news to me!

Presenting: Last Odyssey - Pinball Fantasia
Unreleased NEO GEO pinball game! A complete prototype exists, allegedly the full game, but a dump has never been made available to the public. That means the only people who have played it have had access to the cart(s).

So apparently this guy Billy Pitt has a prototype and he's just sitting on it, hoarding it, refusing to release it. Probably to keep the value up for himself. He has other Neo Geo prototypes that have never been made available to the public, too.

1360_2.png


Direct recorded footage:


http://www.neogeoprotos.com/games/last_odyssey.htm

lo_title.gif


lo1.gif


lo2.gif


lo3.gif


LOdyssey.jpg


lofake2.jpg


if you are curious about Billy Pitt's views on releasing this and other protos here is an interview with him in which he explains his stance. In short: he views the ultimate value of his prototypes as a bargaining chip for trades. He will not sell the games and he definitely won't dump them. He will only give them up in a trade for something he wants.

http://www.culturaneogeo.com/entrevistabillyeng.htm

Do you believe that a proto should be exclusive to its owner or should its ROM be "freed" so that everyone may enjoy the game?


This is a controversial subject. And I apologize in advance, but my answer will be very long! But I do have a very good explanation for why both schools of thought can be seen as correct, so I think it will be worth your time to read it. I truly believe that if the community had the same perspective on the subject, we would all benefit from it.

The first issue is that, in reality, anyone who has a proto is not technically the owner of that proto. They may in many cases be the legitimate owners of the actual physical proto cartridge itself, but not of the actual rom data contained on the eproms. The programmers and/or the companies that they were employed under are the true owners. However, in most cases the companies are out of business and the programmers cannot be located.

The second issue is in regards to how the owner obtained the proto. We all know that these protos are extremely hard to find and/or are extremely expensive to buy from whoever is found to be holding them. We have also seen that they lose their perceived value once the games rom data has been dumped and has been made publically available.

So a proto holder loses his games value and his games trade ability when he decides to share it with the community, but he gains the praise and appreciation of the community. However, a proto holder who keeps the game locked away and unavailable maintains its elusiveness and high end trade value, but he is ridiculed in the community and is called a "rom whore" (rom hoarder)

Usually, when a proto is found in the wild, or is in possession of a casual collector, it will eventually find its' way to being released. The reason for this being that money becomes the motivating factor for the owner and the community eventually provides it.

The problem is when a proto happens to be in the hands of a high end collector. Since money is NOT a motivating factor for them, the only approach is a trade. In addition, trading with a high end collector is at the absolute highest level. It is not something that can be negotiated easily because you have to bring to the table something that they do not have! In most cases, the only thing that qualifies is the same thing they have, an unreleased proto! So trading protos is a high stakes poker game which not everybody can play.




Why do you think there are collectors who still defend the idea that there should be no sharing?

It is usually a split right down the middle. It is easy for those who do not have any time or money invested into tracking down & acquiring a proto to demand that it be given to the community for free. They have no understanding or appreciation for the personal & financial loss that the collector suffers as a result.

In the Atari, Sega, & Nintendo communities, we have what are called "controlled community releases" The collector is compensated for his game through a direct initial payment which is paid for by making a small production run of cartridges which are sold at a cost per unit that offsets the cost of buying the rom data and/or the proto cartridge from the owner.

However, much like a collector with a rare coin, painting, or manuscript, owning a one of a kind game that no one else in the world has can be quite a thrill and give a sense of euphoria. It has the power to manipulate your thinking. Allow me to share from my personal experience.

In February of 2003, I acquired my first NEOGEO proto game, Ghost Lop. At the time, I was very naïve and inexperienced. I had spent quite a bit of money to buy the game, and I was anxious to recuperate it. While I enjoyed some of the attention, I was nonetheless foolish. I was manipulated and rushed into making a bad trade decision with the game, and as a result Ghost Lop lost its' status as a high end trade. Immediately after this all happened, I promised myself that I would never again make the same mistake with the next one that I acquired. So specifically in regards to NEOGEO protos, my policy is a trade-only policy. They are not for sale, not at any price. Only an even exchange with another high end collector for another unreleased proto will even qualify.

Sadly, the only way that they will ever see the light of day, will be when all 172 numbers are 100% accounted for. And the only way that they will ever be dumped or released, will be when the other holders do the same. It is a stalemate. A Mexican standoff!

So take it as you will. he invested the time and the money in tracking the games down and he doesn't actually have the rights to release the software online.

On the other hand, it certainly does come off as selfish as he has also locked away these games and prevented anyone else from making the choice to buy and release them, legally or otherwise. Considering he will only give them up in trade that means even money can't buy us this game.
 
Last edited:

1upsuper

Member
Jan 30, 2018
5,489
Do you believe that a proto should be exclusive to its owner or should its ROM be "freed" so that everyone may enjoy the game?


This is a controversial subject. And I apologize in advance, but my answer will be very long! But I do have a very good explanation for why both schools of thought can be seen as correct, so I think it will be worth your time to read it. I truly believe that if the community had the same perspective on the subject, we would all benefit from it.

The first issue is that, in reality, anyone who has a proto is not technically the owner of that proto. They may in many cases be the legitimate owners of the actual physical proto cartridge itself, but not of the actual rom data contained on the eproms. The programmers and/or the companies that they were employed under are the true owners. However, in most cases the companies are out of business and the programmers cannot be located.

The second issue is in regards to how the owner obtained the proto. We all know that these protos are extremely hard to find and/or are extremely expensive to buy from whoever is found to be holding them. We have also seen that they lose their perceived value once the games rom data has been dumped and has been made publically available.

So a proto holder loses his games value and his games trade ability when he decides to share it with the community, but he gains the praise and appreciation of the community. However, a proto holder who keeps the game locked away and unavailable maintains its elusiveness and high end trade value, but he is ridiculed in the community and is called a "rom whore" (rom hoarder)

Usually, when a proto is found in the wild, or is in possession of a casual collector, it will eventually find its' way to being released. The reason for this being that money becomes the motivating factor for the owner and the community eventually provides it.

The problem is when a proto happens to be in the hands of a high end collector. Since money is NOT a motivating factor for them, the only approach is a trade. In addition, trading with a high end collector is at the absolute highest level. It is not something that can be negotiated easily because you have to bring to the table something that they do not have! In most cases, the only thing that qualifies is the same thing they have, an unreleased proto! So trading protos is a high stakes poker game which not everybody can play.




Why do you think there are collectors who still defend the idea that there should be no sharing?

It is usually a split right down the middle. It is easy for those who do not have any time or money invested into tracking down & acquiring a proto to demand that it be given to the community for free. They have no understanding or appreciation for the personal & financial loss that the collector suffers as a result.

In the Atari, Sega, & Nintendo communities, we have what are called "controlled community releases" The collector is compensated for his game through a direct initial payment which is paid for by making a small production run of cartridges which are sold at a cost per unit that offsets the cost of buying the rom data and/or the proto cartridge from the owner.

However, much like a collector with a rare coin, painting, or manuscript, owning a one of a kind game that no one else in the world has can be quite a thrill and give a sense of euphoria. It has the power to manipulate your thinking. Allow me to share from my personal experience.

In February of 2003, I acquired my first NEOGEO proto game, Ghost Lop. At the time, I was very naïve and inexperienced. I had spent quite a bit of money to buy the game, and I was anxious to recuperate it. While I enjoyed some of the attention, I was nonetheless foolish. I was manipulated and rushed into making a bad trade decision with the game, and as a result Ghost Lop lost its' status as a high end trade. Immediately after this all happened, I promised myself that I would never again make the same mistake with the next one that I acquired. So specifically in regards to NEOGEO protos, my policy is a trade-only policy. They are not for sale, not at any price. Only an even exchange with another high end collector for another unreleased proto will even qualify.

Sadly, the only way that they will ever see the light of day, will be when all 172 numbers are 100% accounted for. And the only way that they will ever be dumped or released, will be when the other holders do the same. It is a stalemate. A Mexican standoff!

Yikes. I have little patience for rom hoarders like this. "However, much like a collector with a rare coin, painting, or manuscript, owning a one of a kind game that no one else in the world has can be quite a thrill and give a sense of euphoria. It has the power to manipulate your thinking." Yeah, it's called avarice. He has the opportunity to benefit the community and by his own admission there are ways to recoup the loss, but nah. I seriously cannot get over the fact that he uses greed and avarice to justify his actions.
 

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
As for amazing pinball discoveries, I have another for you that just recently became news to me!

Presenting: Last Odyssey - Pinball Fantasia
Unreleased NEO GEO pinball game! A complete prototype exists, allegedly the full game, but a dump has never been made available to the public. That means the only people who have played it have had access to the cart(s).

So apparently this guy Billy Pitt has a prototype and he's just sitting on it, hoarding it, refusing to release it. Probably to keep the value up for himself. He has other Neo Geo prototypes that have never been made available to the public, too.

1360_2.png


Direct recorded footage:


http://www.neogeoprotos.com/games/last_odyssey.htm

lo_title.gif


lo1.gif


lo2.gif


lo3.gif


LOdyssey.jpg


lofake2.jpg


if you are curious about Billy Pitt's views on releasing this and other protos here is an interview with him in which he explains his stance. In short: he views the ultimate value of his prototypes as a bargaining chip for trades. He will not sell the games and he definitely won't dump them. He will only give them up in a trade for something he wants.

http://www.culturaneogeo.com/entrevistabillyeng.htm

So take it as you will. he invested the time and the money in tracking the games down and he doesn't actually have the rights to release the software online.

On the other hand, it certainly does come off as selfish as he has also locked away these games and prevented anyone else from making the choice to buy and release them, legally or otherwise. Considering he will only give them up in trade that means even money can't buy us this game.

I didn't know this game until the last month. It appeared listed in some Neo Geo page in the section of rare releases, while I was looking for information about 'Zed Blade'.

But this is the first time I read about this Billy Pit guy, and it's amusing. He thinks that he invested his time and money in creating the game, not the developers, graphic designers, illustrators and musicians. He even puts a watermark with his name in every single screenshot. Human nature will never cease to impress me :)
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Anyone recommend Zaccarina? Thinking of picking up at least the Gold package. Played the free tables and Ireally like the feel of them and the graphics are vastly superior to PA.

Zaccaria looks good on mobile but I think TPA DX11 looks much better on PC, especially regarding textures.

Zaccaria is a good value if you enjoy those tables. I personally find most of them to be pretty underwhelming and they were way behind the rest of the industry at the time. There's definitely some jank, too, but nothing worse than what you can find in TPA. I do think Farsight has a more accurate recreation with how they scan in textures and models. I think more recent TPA tables have better physics, too.

I have Gold on my iPad but I'd be lying if I said I have played it enough to justify the purchase. I'm sure the games are more fun IRL but very few compelled me. I mostly bought it just to have it and to support another developer making pinball software.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Yikes. I have little patience for rom hoarders like this. "However, much like a collector with a rare coin, painting, or manuscript, owning a one of a kind game that no one else in the world has can be quite a thrill and give a sense of euphoria. It has the power to manipulate your thinking." Yeah, it's called avarice. He has the opportunity to benefit the community and by his own admission there are ways to recoup the loss, but nah. I seriously cannot get over the fact that he uses greed and avarice to justify his actions.

I think in the debate of whether or not someone holding on to rare art has an obligation to make it accessible to the public the answer is no, ethically, but yes, morally.

A person with a painting should allow it to be photographed.

A person with a one of a kind film print should allow it to be copied.

A person with a rare game prototype should allow the ROM to be dumped.

But they don't have to as long as they are comfortable knowing they're assholes. Which Billy Pitt apparently is.
 

meppi64

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,479
I think in the debate of whether or not someone holding on to rare art has an obligation to make it accessible to the public the answer is no, ethically, but yes, morally.

A person with a painting should allow it to be photographed.

A person with a one of a kind film print should allow it to be copied.

A person with a rare game prototype should allow the ROM to be dumped.

But they don't have to as long as they are comfortable knowing they're assholes. Which Billy Pitt apparently is.

100% agree with you there.
A copy of something doesn't decrease the value of the original. All it does is give other people the opportunity to appreciate it as well, which mostly has the side effect of driving the originals value even more up.
So yeah, it seems to be more about ego than anything else.
"nah nah nah nah naaaah na! Look at what I got! You can't have it!" type of deal. Zero respect for assholes like that, and I personally dislike unofficial emulation, so there's that. lol
Look, I'm spending way to much time in my life on digitising and restoring old UK videogame magazines myself. Think at least half of my free time.
The point of that being is two-fold. Preserving something brittle that is getting rarer and rarer by the year and making it easier for people to enjoy these magazines once again, without needing to pay some hoarder 100+ € for a certain issue that he buys up whenever it pops up so he can keep the price elevated beyond reason.


Anyway.
I'll need your help once more, I'm afraid.

My mom came by with some old photo albums for me to scan in, and lo and behold, there are actually some pinball machines in there. :)
Now try not to laugh, these are pictures, mostly of me when I was between 3 and 9 or so, well besides the first one. No idea who that it.


The only thing I can say is that this should all be between 1979 and 1986, maybe 1987 I think and that the one with the hearts is a Gotlieb table it seems.
For the rest, I'm completely clueless right now. Well besides the Trident table, obviously. :D
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
100% agree with you there.
A copy of something doesn't decrease the value of the original. All it does is give other people the opportunity to appreciate it as well, which mostly has the side effect of driving the originals value even more up.
So yeah, it seems to be more about ego than anything else.
"nah nah nah nah naaaah na! Look at what I got! You can't have it!" type of deal. Zero respect for assholes like that, and I personally dislike unofficial emulation, so there's that. lol
Look, I'm spending way to much time in my life on digitising and restoring old UK videogame magazines myself. Think at least half of my free time.
The point of that being is two-fold. Preserving something brittle that is getting rarer and rarer by the year and making it easier for people to enjoy these magazines once again, without needing to pay some hoarder 100+ € for a certain issue that he buys up whenever it pops up so he can keep the price elevated beyond reason.


Anyway.
I'll need your help once more, I'm afraid.

My mom came by with some old photo albums for me to scan in, and lo and behold, there are actually some pinball machines in there. :)
Now try not to laugh, these are pictures, mostly of me when I was between 3 and 9 or so, well besides the first one. No idea who that it.



The only thing I can say is that this should all be between 1979 and 1986, maybe 1987 I think and that the one with the hearts is a Gotlieb table it seems.
For the rest, I'm completely clueless right now. Well besides the Trident table, obviously. :D


Super cute pics and I have mad respect for your efforts to preserve those magazines. I'd actually be interested in looking at some of them myself, being raised in America.

I'll see what I can do to identify those games!

The Gottlieb game with the heart is "Joker Poker" from 1978. Classic, great backglass.

jokepoke1.jpg


Interesting thing about Joker Poker is that it arrived right in the middle of the transition from EM to Solid State and there was a version of each the same year. The EM pictured above, the Solid State below.

image-10.jpg
 
Last edited:

meppi64

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,479
Super cute pics and I have mad respect for your efforts to preserve those magazines. I'd actually be interested in looking at some of them myself, being raised in America.

I'll see what I can do to identify those games!

The Gottlieb game with the heart is "Joker Poker" from 1978. Classic, great backglass.

jokepoke1.jpg


Interesting thing about Joker Poker is that it arrived right in the middle of the transition from EM to Solid State and there was a version of each the same year. The EM pictured above, the Solid State below.

image-10.jpg
Wow that's fantastic! :D

I barely remember anything from that table. Only the drop targets with the cards on them ring a bell, but only very faintly.
Then again, looking at the date, I must have been just about 2-3 or so...perhaps 3 looking at the picture.

Right now I'm working with a big Neo Geo collector from the UK to preserve the very first Neo Geo fanzine there.
Quite a bit of work, but it's a real passion project, so I don't mind the least bit all the time that gets put into them.
Many people, especially the younger generation tend to just look at classic games and see old games and only that.
But it's much more than that, and once you start putting everything back together again, magazine, tv shows, etc you start recreating the atmosphere of the time and everything gets a bit more context, which makes it all even more interesting.
Well at least to me. :)
 

Slam Tilt

Member
Jan 16, 2018
5,585
Zaccaria is a good value if you enjoy those tables. I personally find most of them to be pretty underwhelming and they were way behind the rest of the industry at the time. There's definitely some jank, too, but nothing worse than what you can find in TPA.
I like them, even with the very low-tech approach of the games. You can see the attempts to be appealing and unique while competing against the titans from the USA. I particularly like Robot for its pop-up gimmick and Farfalla's challenging layout.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
I'm too lazy to make a new post so I'm just embedding my tweets. Here's a really cool Spanish pinball table I found.





I have a few more I'll share soon. Awesome art.

I like them, even with the very low-tech approach of the games. You can see the attempts to be appealing and unique while competing against the titans from the USA. I particularly like Robot for its pop-up gimmick and Farfalla's challenging layout.

I definitely recommend everyone try it and decide for themselves if they like it. I also recommend supporting any pinball developers beyond the quick cash-grab shovelware stuff.
 
Last edited:

Mezentine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,006
I should post some pics of the Hearts and Spades EM machine my parents own that I grew up with. There's something so satisfyingly chunky about the sounds and responses of machines from that era, I just love them
 

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
A patch for 'Pinball FX 3' in Switch has been released. It hasn't improved the FPS in portable mode, still 30 FPS. So I will pass of the Jurassic Park tables. I already purchased half of the table packs to show my support in Switch. This is enough, until they can improve things.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
A patch for 'Pinball FX 3' in Switch has been released. It hasn't improved the FPS in portable mode, still 30 FPS. So I will pass of the Jurassic Park tables. I already purchased half of the table packs to show my support in Switch. This is enough, until they can improve things.

That's really disappointing. I wonder if they'll even go through with it. Must be struggling to hit 60fps without murdering the graphics. I'll pester them on twitter later and see what they say. They're pretty communicative with the fans.

Meanwhile, Jurassic Park on iPad for me! Really excited for this set. Plus only $2/table on mobile.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
31,358
That's really disappointing. I wonder if they'll even go through with it. Must be struggling to hit 60fps without murdering the graphics. I'll pester them on twitter later and see what they say. They're pretty communicative with the fans.

Meanwhile, Jurassic Park on iPad for me! Really excited for this set. Plus only $2/table on mobile.
I'd still get it on switch because I like the platform.

Also awaiting your evaluation on the jp tables
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Can you let me know if they are any good? They look amazing tbh!

Some of the platforms let you download a free trial of every table. I know PS4 does, can't remember about Switch (i think so?). Alas, mobile does not.

The mobile app hasn't updates yet but after PSN updates I'll probably DL the trial if mobile is behind.

I'd still get it on switch because I like the platform.

Also awaiting your evaluation on the jp tables

Aww shucks!

Yeah, Switch *would* be perfect if they fixed that framerate. I wonder if they at least upped the docked res to 1080p with this patch. I'll check it out later.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
A patch for 'Pinball FX 3' in Switch has been released. It hasn't improved the FPS in portable mode, still 30 FPS. So I will pass of the Jurassic Park tables. I already purchased half of the table packs to show my support in Switch. This is enough, until they can improve things.

When did that PBFX3 Switch patch drop?

Because I just downloaded it and there's no Jurassic Park tables shown anywhere.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
31,358
Also HotHamBoy if the tables get your approval, we should make it the Next tourney since it's such a popular theme that most of us will pick it up
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Also HotHamBoy if the tables get your approval, we should make it the Next tourney since it's such a popular theme that most of us will pick it up

I'm totally down for that.

Meppi definitely won that last "tourney", though.

We really need more participation!

The JP tables look really good. I was pretry bummed with the Universal pack, I tried to like those tabls but I just couldn't. They're not bad or anything but something about them just seem off. Bland.

Carnivals & Legends is some of their best, tho, IMO.

Couple weird things IMO which might have something to do with Marvel and Star Wars and Disney and maybe even their abscence on Switch.

Did you know the last Marvel table was released in September 2016? The Women of Power 2 Pack.

The last Star Wars table was Rogue One.

Now, I point this out because they were steady on making tables based on Marvel movies if the character(s) didn't already have a table based on the comics.

Avengers, Age of Ultron, Guardians of the Galaxy, Ant Man... then zip.

Black Panther would make a fantastic pinball table, has no comic book table. Where the hell is the Black Panther table?

Where the hell is The Last Jedi table? They've done Clone Wars, Rebels, The Force Awakens, Rogue One...no Last Jedi.

So I don't know what's going on with that and their license.
 
Last edited:

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
When did that PBFX3 Switch patch drop?

Because I just downloaded it and there's no Jurassic Park tables shown anywhere.

In Spain, all the eshop updates appear at the 15:00 PM. Now in Spain, is 16:21 PM. The update appeared together with the new table pack in the eshop. And the patch plus the tables pack will start rolling in each country in their respective time zones.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
In Spain, all the eshop updates appear at the 15:00 PM. Now in Spain, is 16:21 PM. The update appeared together with the new table pack in the eshop. And the patch plus the tables pack will start rolling in each country in their respective time zones.

Ahh, maybe the new update hasn't released here yet and I downloaded an older one. Havent used the Switch PBFX3 in a long time.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
31,358
I'm totally down for that.

Meppi definitely won that last "tourney", though.

We really need more participation!

The JP tables look really good. I was pretry bummed with the Universal pack, I tried to like those tabls but I just couldn't. They're not bad or anything but something about them just seem off. Bland.

Carnivals & Legends is some of their best, tho, IMO.

Couple weird things IMO which might have something to do with Marvel and Star Wars and Disney and maybe even their abscence on Switch.

Did you know the last Marvel table was released in September 2016? The Women of Power 2 Pack.

The last Star Wars table was Rogue One.

Now, I point this out because they were steady on making tables based on Marvel movies if the character(s) didn't already have a table based on the comics.

Avengers, Age of Ultron, Guardians of the Galaxy, Ant Man... then zip.

Black Panther would make a fantastic pinball table, has no comic book table. Where the hell is the Black Panther table?

Where the hell is The Last Jedi table? They've done Clone Wars, Rebels, The Force Awakens, Rogue One...no Last Jedi.

So I don't know what's going on with that and their license.
It's possible they are renewing it, since they said both will be making it to switch later. It's also possible they have to renegotiate for new platforms. If they lost it all then they would have been delisted.

Also, for real tourney challenges, it might be worth making new threads for better visibility
 

Epilexia

Member
Jan 27, 2018
2,675
Ahh, maybe the new update hasn't released here yet and I downloaded an older one. Havent used the Switch PBFX3 in a long time.

I suppose that updates appear in all the countries at the same time, giving that each region tends to use the same package. But eshop releases, in this case a DLC, appear in the fixed hour of updates for this country. I don't know what time is this for the Americas :)

This is the first update released for 'Pinball FX 3'. It shows a 1.0.1 number.
 

Chozoman

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
323
Random, location-specific plug...If you're in the greater Pittsburgh area, you owe it to yourself to visit Pinball PA, (sprawling warehouse packed to the gills with classic and modern pinball and arcade games. Pay one price and play all you like).

That is all.
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Random, location-specific plug...If you're in the greater Pittsburgh area, you owe it to yourself to visit Pinball PA, (sprawling warehouse packed to the gills with classic and modern pinball and arcade games. Pay one price and play all you like).

That is all.
I have family near Pittsburgh and there's a lot of great pinball spots but I've never been to any of them. Haven't been to PA in years.

You heard of The Kickback Cafe? (amazing name!)

Their digs were cooler before they changed locations but they're still pretty cool from what I can tell. I want to check it out.
DSC08689-600x338-600x338.jpg

annanewman-kickback-cafe.png

kickback%20may14.jpg

kickback-e1498144720980.jpg


The artist who did all their graphic design also did a few pinball custom rethemes they were hosting, too.
Kickback_02c_958cc5e0ce9e8b61b7d8ceb036d1f79e.jpg

Bullet-Holderman-09.jpg

3754398890_7a0f192dec_b.jpg

Backglass.jpg

etsjuns08rrwf4d3hbwe.jpg


All that and it's a gourmet coffee cafe.

My dream palace.
 
Last edited:

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Tables should be live now. They popped up on Switch and iOS. Bought all 3, will evaluate over the day.

Edit: i'm already really diggin the Pinball Mayhem table. Fun layout.
 
Last edited:

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,409
I so wish other Pro Pinball games get the 'Ultra" treatment. That game is so crazy good. I couldn't resist turning my TV into a pinball table (laying it horizontal on a stand) once to play the Timeshock that way. It was good. I love playing Timeshock on the ipad and on my phone as well. It looks so nice on a high DPI screen, like some freaking holographic diorama almost, lol.

TPA is also great, my favorite being the PS4 version, for the quality of visuals and ease of use. Visuals from the PS4/DX11 PC version is also something I wish they would bring to the iOS version already.

Speaking of, are there any screenshot comparisons between the PS4 and DX11 version of TPA now? For a very long time PS4 version held a significant advantage visually over all the other versions, but DX11 update on PC was finally supposed to bring it in line with that, or beyond. Also, PS4 got some update for lighting settings the other day, but I didn't have a chance to check that yet.
 
Last edited:

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
I so wish other Pro Pinball games get the 'Ultimate" treatment. That game is so crazy good. I couldn't resist turning my TV into a pinball table (laying it horizontal on a stand) once to play the Timeshock that way. It was good. I love playing Timeshock on the ipad and on my phone as well. It looks so nice on a high DPI screen, like some freaking holographic diorama almost, lol.

TPA is also great, my favorite being the PS4 version, for the quality of visuals and ease of use. Visuals from the PS4/DX11 PC version is also something I wish they would bring to the iOS version already.

Speaking of, are there any screenshot comparisons between the PS4 and DX11 version of TPA now? For a very long time PS4 version held a significant advantage visually over all the other versions, but DX11 update on PC was finally supposed to bring it in line with that, or beyond. Also, PS4 got some update for lighting settings the other day, but I didn't have a chance to check that yet.

I want more Pro tables to get the Ultra Edition, too. Barnstorm said that was plan.... when they launched the Kickstarter for Timeshock! in 2012.

Again, the Kickstarter was funded In 2012.

88aebeb7ee7a41a722d4539b94a6ae64_original.JPG


There's no sign whatsoever of an XBL version, which was funded. The website for Pro Pinball still says "coming soon to Linux."
 

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
Ok, guys, I know maybe a few of you were waiting for impressions on the new Jurassic Park tables.

Here's my feeling on them at the end of Day 1: Fantastic! I give them my highest grade on the Zen scale: 6 out of 6 (yeah, i have a weird scale)

It might change after more play, sure, I need more time. But they immediately feel really fun and inventive from the start and I didn't feel that about the Universal pack at all. The only 3-pack to impress me this much on day 1 is Bethesda Pinball.

I love these layouts, lots of fun shots and great flow. And maybe it's just the JP license/Dino theme but these tables are compelling and I feel like I want to explore these tables and figure out all their hidden modes and secrets.

All 3 tables manage to avoid the standard Zen Pinball design template. So many of PBFX tables design modes by assigning a word to each shot and having you collect a letter from that word each time you make that shot to start the mode. Personally, I find this format to be way too over-relied upon and generally rather dull. Example:
Wild-West-Rampage.png



They aren't perfect, though. Quite frankly, the lack of original film music is a huge sore spot and it's noticeably missing. I even recommend just muting the music because it's distractingly not JP music despite trying to evoke the same feelings. It's really generic.

That said, hearing the original film clips is great and adds a lot of nostalgic feeling. The Universal, Star Wars and Marvel movie tables used sound-alike VAs and it was annoying. Hearing the real actors makes a massive difference (but we knew it would because of the Aliens table).

The best solution is mute the Zen music and put on the Jurassic Park music in another app in the background. Then you've got the authentic JP experience!

Anyway, love these tables already. If you enjoy Zen at all you can buy these with confidence. Even if you haven't been impressed with Zen in the past I suggest giving these a fair try.

Rating: 9 out of 10 Camera-Wielding Velociraptor-Mercenaries.
Point deducted for lack of original music.

original-13673-1434346673-4.jpg


BTW, you guys ever played the real table with this awesome T-Rex mod? I played it at the Louisville Arcade Expo and it rules. So much better.
07e064c158299f8d45604306eb0465c4bf13b21e.png

6d9c6c806121ced2208eb8116596889081c9f7d6.jpg

20161113_193954_1024x1024.jpg


Jurassic Park mods are my fetish.
 
Last edited:

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,409
I want more Pro tables to get the Ultra Edition, too. Barnstorm said that was plan.... when they launched the Kickstarter for Timeshock! in 2012.

Again, the Kickstarter was funded In 2012.

88aebeb7ee7a41a722d4539b94a6ae64_original.JPG


There's no sign whatsoever of an XBL version, which was funded. The website for Pro Pinball still says "coming soon to Linux."
lol, yeah, I followed the development with a baited breath. It's amazing the game ever got made, with how many delays it had, nevermind that it's as good as it is. They are still working on it, in some capacity at least. The iOS version of the game got fixed very quickly after it was crashing on iPhone X.

I have the original PC versions of Fantastic Journey and Big Race USA running on my Mac, in a Wine wrapper - which works great - but with every new OS release, there is a new round of struggle to get them working again.
 
Last edited:

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
lol, yeah, I followed the development with a baited breath. It's amazing the game ever got made, with how many delays it had, nevermind that it's as good as it is. They are still working on it, in some capacity at least. The iOS version of the game got fixed very quickly after it was crashing on iPhone X.

I have the original PC versions of Fantastic Journey and Big Race USA running on my Mac, in a Wine wrapper - which works great - but with every new OS release, there is a new round of struggle to get them working again.
It's shocking how well the original tables hold up today. Honestly, I just wish we had higher resolution assets.
 

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,409
Speaking of iOS platform, I want to point out a few gems that I think few people know about:

*edit* OK, I'm an idiot, two of these are literally on the first page, and I forgot about it.

- Crystal Caliburn 2 Pinball: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pinball-crystal-caliburn-ii/id533037359?mt=8
This is a game made by Littlewing - to me unknown Japanese dev team, and it has some of the best ball physics, I've seen. Probably second only to Pro Pinball.
mzl.iadiiofr.png



- Pure Pinball: https://itunes.apple.com/ca/app/pure-pinball/id595966558?mt=8
Made by Legendo Entertainment from Spain, this game is inspired by the great Amiga video pinballs (Dreams/Fantasies/Illusions/SlamTilt) but with modern full color 3D visuals, and really great lighting effects (how I wish TPA looked even close to this engaging on iOS). To keep with the spirit of the games that inspired it, there's a scrolling overhead view, which feels like the view that's actually most playable, and the way the game was meant to be played. Again, very nice ball physics, very dynamic and fun.
screen1024x1024.jpeg


- Pure Pinball: Football Club Barcelona: I can't find the link for this, maybe it was delisted on the app store, but I was able to download it recently because I had purchased it previously :\
Made by the same dev team, same engine and all, it's another Pure Pinball table, and pretty nice in its own right.
screen1136x1136.jpeg


It's shocking how well the original tables hold up today. Honestly, I just wish we had higher resolution assets.
Thankfully, the games were made with good foresight, and support some really high resolutions - but textures don't always look that great. But yeah, these games are a true treasure. Tables that are not a copy of a real world mechanical pinball, but all feel like true classics. And still probably the only video pinball that can at times trick me into thinking that ball movement is *real*.
 
Last edited:

HotHamBoy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,423
We're going to do all 3 Jurassic Park tables in a tournament that will run until Monday. The tourney will be created from within the PBFX3 app, cross platform users can join IIRC.

I don't have the JP tables in PBFX3, just Zen on iOS, so if you guys want to do it that way someone else will need to set it up while I sit it out. Otherwise we can do it like we've been.

Also, I feel there needs to be a new thread just for the release of the Jurassic Park pack because there aren't any threads about those tables and casuals who enjoy the brand might want to check them out.

I can't make the thread or I would so if some kindly soul wants to do it that'd be cool. Just copy/paste the press release and link to it, embed a pic or two from the web page and/or the trailer from YouTube.

Or hell, just embedd one of their tweets if you are feeling lazy.

Oh, and link back to this thread, too ;-)
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
31,358
Ok, HotHamBoy here's what I'm thinking
Title: ERA digital pinball tournament: Jurassic Park(pinball fx3 3-pack)

Intro: Welcome to our first Era tournament, hopefully the first of many. With its release this week we've decided to run a for fun tournament for the new Jurassic Park tables in Pinball FX3. This is all for the fun of having some direct competition with your fellow pinball players here on ERA. There's no prize other than the pride of trying your best.


I'll let you cover the fine tournament details, but needless to say we need: board info, rules, and time frame. I'll start that section by acknowledging you as judge, basically along the lines of 'Here is the Tournament rules and setup from our judge and enthusiast hothamboy'

Might end with a comment that future tournaments could be chosen by popular vote as well

Also can't you create custom tourneys on pinball fx3 on switch