The Dark Times: PC Controllers Pre-X360
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This is what I had. It was a great controller back in the day.Loved that pad back in the days
I actually completed MGS3 on PCSX2 on this controller (or a very similar one) because my 360 controller brokeDark times indeed. Had a Trustmaster Dual Storm. Was decent for certain games but also a living hell trying to get it to work well with others. Thank goodness we no longer have to map buttons for every game.
The left stick started acting weird after like 2 days of use lol
I don't think it's necessarily fair to say this was a PC problem. 3rd Party controllers prior to the PS3/360 era were universally garbage. Even the first party controllers weren't amazing. The 360 being natively compatible with Windows definitely upped the quality, but the quality went up across the board. The DS4 and X1 controllers are definitely higher quality than any console before them.
Wtf is this monstrosity.I'm sure maybe some of you have fond memories of these abortions, but I remember a time when whole genres were highly inaccessible because of the pre-X360 PC gaming industry not having a standard controller design. I think the segregation of certain game genres to certain hardware was interesting and maybe without it, we wouldn't have as many unique gems as we have today. Still, I don't want to imagine playing Bayonetta on any of these...
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Wild! That does not look comfortable lol. I clearly remember the size of that pad. Joysticks need more surface area.The pad came with a screw on joystick.
Alternatively you could try the Saturn 3D controller. The dpad is essentially the same as the Model 2.
The Gravis and Gravis Gamepad Pro were actually decent PC gamepads for its time. The Gravis Eliminator Pro was also OK, very comfortable but the sort-of-analog D-pad (it had a switch) wasn't great.
Aside from being console-quality (well, aside from that D-pad then), the 360 controller also made using a pad more "plug'n'play". Before then games would generally just have numbered buttons, which you'd have to try and figure out how they corresponded to the ones on your specific pad.
Aside from being console-quality (well, aside from that D-pad then), the 360 controller also made using a pad more "plug'n'play". Before then games would generally just have numbered buttons, which you'd have to try and figure out how they corresponded to the ones on your specific pad.
I think I had this one, I'm pretty sure. I loved that my bud and I could daisy-chain ours together so we could play Fifa together with both of us using controllers.
Yeah, getting a decent controller used to suck and then you had to get them to work properly with vague numbers signifying buttons.
I'll always have a soft spot for flight sticks though, mainly because of Wing Commander. I can't believe I played the first game back when just using the keyboard. Then again, I used to play Zelda II and Super C with an Advantage (just because I had one).
If a game support gamepad input, it Just Worked and was easy to config. Now you have to either buy an MS pad or do some otherwise hacky shit to get the thing to show up as an x-input device. And that's for the games that support x-input. If you have a mix, like many of us likely do, you may or may not be able to use it without turning that hacky shit off for fear of double inputs. That and the lazy devs that use x-input and don't let you map controls whatsoever. The fact that I used to be able to use a DS4 via bluetooth as a DirectInput device and after one of the Win10 creator updates no longer can is actually quite annoying. Steam kind of makes this bearable because it actually works, but I don't like having to hand over control of that to Steam because it keeps me from being able to use it outside of Steam.
It should have been great but it's almost worse in a way.
My man!
The Force Feedback Sidewinder was so cool. If you crashed in Star Wars Pod Racer the joystick would have a fucking seizure.
The Saturn controllers had proprietary inputs that were supported by the NV1. If you want to use an original Saturn controller on a modern machine you can acquire a Saturn to USB adapter and purchase the original controller separately. You could also wait to see how the newly revised, officially licensed Retro-Bit controllers shown at CES this year turn out.
There are third party controllers that are X-Input..
Steam configuration tool is great and I think you can use it with games you didn't buy through Steam by adding them as a non-steam game, but if that doesn't work for a specific game or something, I have good news for you, there's a japanese program (don't worry, it's in English) that allows you to remap the X-Input buttons for a specific game. It "patches" the game itself (I think it just patches the .xinput dll? I don't know how this wizardry works exactly) so you don't need to have the program running in the background or anything. You can remove the "patch" at any time by just pointing the program to the game again. It's great.
https://sites.google.com/site/0dd14lab/xinput-plus
The problem is that there wasn't a standard on PC for on-screen button prompts, for how many buttons or axis a device had, etc.
I remember that Gravis game pad. My cousin had 2 of them think — most of the games we played at the time support or just a pain to get them working, so they ended up collecting dust.
Before I got Xbox 360 controller, I was using a USB dongle for my PS2. It worked for while (great for emulation) until it became the main culprit for BSOD's on PC, especially while playing games powered my unreal engine 2/3.
Before I got Xbox 360 controller, I was using a USB dongle for my PS2. It worked for while (great for emulation) until it became the main culprit for BSOD's on PC, especially while playing games powered my unreal engine 2/3.
I used this bad boy back in the late 90s/early 2000s:
Along with the Sidewinder Pro joystick. They weren't bad. The d-pad was better than most of the current gen's, and I'm pretty sure I could still plug in the Sidewinder Pro and it would work like a charm. Nowadays you've got to invest in an expensive HOTAS setup to get a decent joystick.
Along with the Sidewinder Pro joystick. They weren't bad. The d-pad was better than most of the current gen's, and I'm pretty sure I could still plug in the Sidewinder Pro and it would work like a charm. Nowadays you've got to invest in an expensive HOTAS setup to get a decent joystick.
XInput is complete crap. It doesn't even support more than 8 gamepads in UWP, and it only supported 4 gamepads on Windows 7/8/win32, which seriously limits how far developers can go with local multiplayer games. DirectInput didn't have that limit. When you're going to make a gamepad API that basically everyone is forced to use, why not at least make the max gamepad count something ridiculous that you'd never hit?
A long time ago I bought a very cheap PlayStation-like controller with a 360-like Dpad. A friend and I were playing Street Fighter II at uni on an emulator. When he rocked the Dpad around it actually twisted around in a circle, breaking the Dpad.
From that point I always used my GameCube controller on PC with a converter. It served me well, until the 360 controller came along.
From that point I always used my GameCube controller on PC with a converter. It served me well, until the 360 controller came along.
Had one of these for 10 years, gave it to my nephew, still working, was fantastic for BF2,3, Hawx 1,2, Elite Dangerous, Arma 2 and many others.I played a shitload of Freespace 2 with this masterpiece
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro
still have it around here somewhere
Upgraded to an x52 pro for Elite & VR shame new joystick's no longer have FFB.
The 360 controller would be top of that list for me because of the d-pad. The best thing about Microsoft bringing that controller to the window world was it eventually motivated people to get the DS3 and DS4 going. This of course led to 2D games being properly playable.
Before then you just needed a mouse and keyboard for FPS and one of the many amazing joysticks for your flight sims (space or on earth). Sadly the problem there is that the games went away, not that the controllers were bad.
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Whereas before, developers just didn't bother bringing most games to PC. Or controller support was spotty in general.
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Name 5 local-multiplayer PC games where this would even remotely be an issue.
Shit, name 10 local multiplayer PC games in general.
I used to own a Gravis Gamepad and loved the thing, using it to play most of my emulators until the rubber membrane inside the controller completely wore out. I should hunt one down on eBay and see how it compares to my Saturn pad.I'm sure maybe some of you have fond memories of these abortions, but I remember a time when whole genres were highly inaccessible because of the pre-X360 PC gaming industry not having a standard controller design. I think the segregation of certain game genres to certain hardware was interesting and maybe without it, we wouldn't have as many unique gems as we have today. Still, I don't want to imagine playing Bayonetta on any of these...
So many joysticks. So, so many joysticks. I never liked them and I remember old computer stores having pins full of different shitty ones.
I think the single best thing to come of Microsoft entering the video game business is that it resulted in a standard input for PC controllers. What say you? There are dozens upon dozens of examples, the sidewinder sticks out my my memory but still there were a boat load of shitty PC controllers. This OP doesn't do justice to the sheer volume of shit controllers there were.
I used this bad boy back in the late 90s/early 2000s:
Along with the Sidewinder Pro joystick. They weren't bad. The d-pad was better than most of the current gen's, and I'm pretty sure I could still plug in the Sidewinder Pro and it would work like a charm. Nowadays you've got to invest in an expensive HOTAS setup to get a decent joystick.
I had that one too, I quite liked it. I was disappointed when Windows dropped game port support with one of the later versions. You're probably not going to win any fighting game tournaments with this thing, but I liked it for playing RPGs. I bought it for Grim Fandango and Final Final Fantasy VII, so I have fond memories associated with it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux_gaming/comments/6ku8jw/local_multiplayer_with_more_than_4_players/
"PC games" is an unfair restriction due to the reality of arcade and console emulation.
6 player X-Men, Saturn Bomberman (10 players), and their ilk. There are more than 10 of them, and this is all ignoring the fact that maybe there would be more if it were actually easy to support.
Not the point. It's true that it's stupid for Microsoft to not set the controller limit to something ridiculous, like DirectInput did with zero issues. It's just a matter of... why not? Why limit it? It's a valid criticism.
In any case, Gang Beasts supports up to 8 players for example.
And there are many "local multiplayer games in general" for PC, which is why I use the official Xbox One wireless adapter instead of a bluetooth dongle (you can only use 1 controller via bluetooth). Also emulators. I have spent a LOT of time with friends playing local multiplayer games with emulators with 2 Xbox controllers.
High five, man! This was my first flightstick! Very sturdy, and still usable today. I have a Thrustmaster T.16000M FCS though to replace the Saitek X52Pro that came with a boatload of problems with wiring and reliability... Actually I should've just gotten the Throttle separately since the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro has the sort of tension I've come to like with PC flightsticks.I played a shitload of Freespace 2 with this masterpiece
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro
still have it around here somewhere
And remeber, if you're still playing space sims with mouse and keyboard, you're doing it wrong. You're doing it very wrong.
Yeah it was a goofy time. I definitely was on the PSX->USB train for doujin and emulation but it was great to see how quickly all those PC ports started adapting to real gamepad support.
Nope. Back in the day you were expected to keep your drivers updated, and provided you did, DirectInput works as you expected. Most games took into account that there are many controller configurations out there, and hence controller mapping was a standard, unlike post-XInput era where everybody just assumes you're using an XBox 360 gamepad.
Steam is a bandaid solution to the problem. As good as Steam is, what about the games that you don't play on Steam? There's GOG and then publisher exclusive platforms like Origin, so if, say, Titanfall 2 didn't come with full custom remapping, then you're shit outta luck. I'd say you've never really played a bunch of DirectInput games save for a handful of PC ports, because games built from the ground up on PC expected you to have joysticks and other peripherals, even first-person shooters.
Edit: Add to that, I really like the PC peripheral scene back in the day. Razor Hydra, The Orb...all of these crazy ideas that really felt PC gaming was pretty creative and not ideally stagnant.
Case in point:
I miss stuff like this from PC. Now it's all XBOX standardized and bastardized.
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Xinput is dogshit though.
MS could have just upgraded directinput, so we didn't get stuck with all the limitations that xinput brought to the table.
Joysticks and wheels need Hacky solutions because xinput has a limit on analogue axes. DI also supported proper force feedback not just the crappy "vibrate a bunch of motors" crap we get these days.
MS could have just upgraded directinput, so we didn't get stuck with all the limitations that xinput brought to the table.
Joysticks and wheels need Hacky solutions because xinput has a limit on analogue axes. DI also supported proper force feedback not just the crappy "vibrate a bunch of motors" crap we get these days.
I generally really liked the Sidewinder controllers.The Force Feedback Pro joystick was great. The Sidewinder wheel was even better - the force feedback was amazing: playing Monster Truck Madness 2 it used to rearrange everything on my desk! D:
Even the Freestyle Pro's tilt control worked well for its time. The Dual Strike was a mistake though.
Even the Freestyle Pro's tilt control worked well for its time. The Dual Strike was a mistake though.
Yup, if you're making a 2D game with digital controls, you're actually better off at this point using RawInput directly for your gamepad support instead of XInput because it has no arbitrary gamepad limit and actually lets you be compatible with ANY gamepad as opposed to just XInput ones. It's dumb.
Xinput was the best and worst thing to happen to PC gamepads. It brought a level of standardization that didn't exist for game controllers on PC, but that same standardization stifled innovation and locked everyone to the button and axis layout of a 360 controller. Also, Microsoft intentionally sabotaged Xinput based controllers on DirectInput based games, due to how the triggers work in DirectInput mode (can't use both at the same time.)
I had this one, it was pretty fantastic. Really good for basically anything pre-dual analog sticks.
The Thrustmaster Digital Firestorm 2 (6 face buttons) carried me for a while.
I had this one, it was pretty fantastic. Really good for basically anything pre-dual analog sticks.
It is sad that the Steam controller is the most innovative game controller these days (also note that it sidesteps xinput too).
It is neat but so much more could be done if things didn't have to conform to a shitty standard.
Also amusing is the most innovative thing on the xb1 controller, in typical MS bullshit, it is only available in UWP.
It is neat but so much more could be done if things didn't have to conform to a shitty standard.
Also amusing is the most innovative thing on the xb1 controller, in typical MS bullshit, it is only available in UWP.
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I wouldn't argue with anyone who enjoyed dinput, people like what they like and if there's something so limiting about xinput that can't be fixed with in-game remapping or Steam remapping fair play. But it's preposterous to suggest that xinput is objectively "worse." The primary limiting factor to pre-xinput was a. games simply not coming out for PC and b. setting up and figuring out compatibility being a pain in the ass.
Saying xinput sucks and is objectively worse because it only supports 8 inputs for local multiplayer is quite frankly, fucking stupid. It it a limitation? Sure. But when even the person making the argument can barely muster up a single title where it could ever be an issue, it's a non-issue.
I'd venture to say, xinput has had a HUGE hand in making PC gaming as ubiquitous as it is today.
Saying xinput sucks and is objectively worse because it only supports 8 inputs for local multiplayer is quite frankly, fucking stupid. It it a limitation? Sure. But when even the person making the argument can barely muster up a single title where it could ever be an issue, it's a non-issue.
I'd venture to say, xinput has had a HUGE hand in making PC gaming as ubiquitous as it is today.
XInput standardized the peripheral setup on PCs to attract the Xbox crowd fresh off of playing Halo...
It has objectively worse flaws: Standardised number of buttons means you cannot exceed the button count of an XBox without breaking the XInput standard (more buttons was useful for flight sticks and non-console-like peripherals). It also created issues with the pre-existing PC controller market: XInput was not backwards compatible, and you needed 3rd party apps like XPadder to make something like a Logitech Dual Action to work in the PC version of Assassin's Creed. Controller remapping is also another big issue as well: the decrease of fully customizable controls decrease with the rise of XInput games. Using Steam as a remapping option is only viable for Steam games (again, I bring up GOG and other proprietary PC platforms), and even then, it not always guaranteed to work (I've tried a couple of games using my Wii U Pro Controller without the Mayflash adapter for XInput translation...some functions just outright don't work or isn't recognized).
This is my problem with Microsoft turning PCs into an XBox in general.
If one likes limitations so much, then they should go back to consoles.
Xinput is objectively worse.
As I noted before, MS could have introduced canonical profiles to direct input, without chucking it out in favour of a shittier limited API.
This would have served both worlds perfectly fine. Unfortunately all of this happened during GFWL, which totally explains why xinput on PC exists as it does.
I've been using a variety of USB adapters for dualshock controllers for as long as I can remember.
I still use one of these for DDR dance pads, steering wheels and a Beatmania controller.